Whenever believers try to defend their faith in an intervening God using reason (or more precisely, pseudo-reason), the critical thinker cannot help but point out the fallacies. There is this email being circulated that tries to explain the problem of evil and why God allows pain and suffering:
A man went to a barbershop to have his hair cut and his beard trimmed. As the barber began to work, they began to have a good conversation. They talked about so many things and various subjects. When they eventually touched on the subject of God, the barber said: “I don’t believe that God exists.”
“Why do you say that?” asked the customer. “Well, you just have to go out in the street to realize that God doesn’t exist. Tell me, if God exists, would there be so many sick people? Would there be abandoned children? If God existed, there would be neither suffering nor pain. I can’t imagine a loving God who would allow all of these things.”
The customer thought for a moment, but didn’t respond because he didn’t want to start an argument. The barber finished his job and the customer left the shop.
Just after he left the barbershop, he saw a man in the street with long, stringy, dirty hair and an untrimmed beard. He looked dirty and unkempt. The customer turned back and entered the barber shop again and he said to the barber: “You know what? Barbers do not exist.” “How can you say that?” asked the surprised barber. “I am here, and I am a barber. And I just worked on you!” “No!” the customer exclaimed. “Barbers don’t exist because if they did, there would be no people with dirty long hair and untrimmed beards, like that man outside.”
“Ah, but barbers DO exist! That’s what happens when people do not come to me.” “Exactly!” affirmed the customer. “That’s the point! God, too, DOES exist! That’s what happens when people do not go to Him and don’t look to Him for help. That’s why there’s so much pain and suffering in the world.” * * *
Let us try to dissect the logic here:
Barber – does not believe a loving and all-powerful God exists because of the presence of suffering and pain as manifested by sick people and abandoned children
Customer – does not believe barbers exist because of the presence of people with dirty long hair and untrimmed beards
Barber – explains that these people are unkempt because they do not come to him for a haircut and shave
Customer – explains that people experience so much pain and suffering because they do not come to God for help
I cannot even begin to pinpoint the logical fallacies in there because they seem to jump out all at once. It is faulty to compare barbers to God because whenever you go to the former, you’ll surely get your hair cut (if that’s what you want); when you seek help from the latter, your prayers are not always answered. Now if the faithful even dare to say that the barber is not there all the time to give you a haircut anytime you want – maybe he’s sick or attending some important event – it must be noted that unlike God, barbers are not omnipotent or omnipresent. And what exactly does it mean to “come to God for help”? If God is omniscient, he knows what we need (and deserve) long before we pray for it – even before we can think of praying for it. And if he is a loving God, he will grant these needs without waiting for our prayers, not to mention there are children dying a slow and painful death due to starvation and disease who are too young to understand the concept of God, much less to pray. But I guess the most significant difference between a haircut and an “answered prayer” is that you can be sure that your hair had not just gotten shorter because of pure coincidence and no external deliberate force.
I must say that while I often criticize religion, I deeply respect the faithful, as many of the people in my innermost circle are themselves believers. As I often tell them, I respect your right to your beliefs. If you say that you believe in God because of personal faith, I respect that. Even if you say that you believe in God because the Bible (or any other holy book) tells you so, I would still respect that. But once you try to assert the validity of the Bible’s claims by spewing fallacy passed as reason, your beliefs become fair game.
The problem of evil had been an eternal bug up the theistic ass, and countless theodicies (attempts at reconciling belief in God with the perceived existence of evil) have been written, their answers ranging from almost-but-not-quite satisfactory to totally absurd. Among those I’ve read, I think the only one that gives the slightest hope to the faithful and prevents those in No. 6 in Dawkins’ spectrum from ‘falling’ into No. 7 is that God has a purpose too grand to be comprehended by our finite minds. Perhaps I can respect that, but only because I cannot scientifically disprove it. Just make sure you don’t get too cocky as to proclaim that you can actually prove it.
Costumer was right..It happened because people were turning away from God..not God turning away from people, We need God to protect us.. God exists..He is the Alpha and Omega.
I'm glad that a number of Filipinos are getting critical. Religion had its time. We have to let it go because it doesn't really help in the pursuit of an authentic existence.
There is suffering in this world because of us… We are ALL, selfish, proud people, who thinks that we are better than anybody else….there is no right or left..we are all proud creatures trying to be little gods…doing our "own" thing……so if you want peace without suffering God needs to kill us all…. the answer is not religion, moralism, nor spirituality…. the answer is Jesus….. Yup I am a Jesus freak…just a nobody trying to tell you guys about that Somebody
http://www.christianityexplored.org/tough-questio…
It's easy to find a barber, in a Barbershop.
Now where do I go to find God?
All I'm going to find in a church are priests.
Also
Don't blame the barber why your hair is long. Blame your hair follicles for your hairiness.
Don't blame God because you are suffering. Blame the people who caused you to suffer.
There is one big paradox in this scenario: God is supposed to be omnipotent, so why can't he do anything about the sick and the suffering, as compared to a human barber who is obviously only capable of helping the unkempt in his shop?
If it's indeed an all-powerful God who refuses to help, then it's a malevolent god. If God is incapable of helping, then that nullifies the claim of omnipotence. Either way, is that a God I'd want to worship.
On the flip side, if I were that man, I'd be very careful of saying wonky logic like that in front of an atheist barber – a man who by profession will hold an extremely sharp object to your throat on a daily basis.
…remember Sweeney Todd?
Twin-Skies wrote: "On the flip side, if I were that man, I’d be very careful of saying wonky logic like that in front of an atheist barber – a man who by profession will hold an extremely sharp object to your throat on a daily basis.
…remember Sweeney Todd?"
You never cease to amaze me, Twin-Skies. And if that comment of yours were posted at the forum (or in your own article), I'm sure you'd accompany that with the appropriate picture. 🙂
It's been my longstanding belief that among other things, a freethinker should share traits with the ideal British Officer:
Stoic, Steadfast, and most importantly, in possession of an indestructible sense of humor XD
Yeah, barber in this tale has all the tools. He's got the right arguments. And a razor. Which he wields very skilfully.
Predominantly poor and religious countries are huge barbershops where customers have been asking for a cut for centuries. But their hair and beards have grown in biblical proportions (ie, like you see in the illustrated Bibles) with no sign that the barber will ever come in for work. The problem is, the customers forgot that they have created the barbershops, there is no barber, and if they want their hair and beards trimmed they'd have to do it themselves or do it for each other.
Good post 🙂 By the way, where are you now on the Dawkins spectrum?
Thanks, Ryan. 🙂 As to the specific idea of the intervening Abrahamic God (theism), I'm at #6. As to the general idea of a creator who, after causing the Big Bang, simply let the universe unfold according to the natural laws (deism), I no longer care. If there is indeed a creator, he/she/it probably wouldn't care or mind about what I believe anyway. I doubt that a Being powerful and intelligent enough to be able to create the entire cosmos would be that insecure.
You may still believe in God while at the same time denying the Bible, why don't?
"You may still believe in God while at the same time denying the Bible,"
Hence the followers of the Quran, Buddhism, and Hindusim.
He may be an atheist in the sense that he worship no God, not in the way that he believe that God do not exist. That's what I think.
No, I'm suggesting him to be a deist.
Hi Tradcath. In case you're interested to know my stand, I just wrote an article about it. 🙂
https://filipinofreethinkers.org/2010/07/17/a-form…
Great Post! Yeah with all those fallacies and assumptions jumping at the same time, I would certainly be at a loss to reply. It's the Kwentong Barbero was like throwing myself at middle of the Rockies or the Himalayans, where do you begin!
no wonder god keeps losing customers like us everyday, lousy customer service…
it's like religion is the world's worst insurance scam, you have all these pushy evangelists and their marketing hype about how prayers can move mountains but turns out to be complete vaporware when you really need it the most, it's then that you find out that there's a mountain of exclusions to the power of prayer… no selfish intent, no selfless intent if it doesn't jive with god's secret plan, no testing god… and you find out that all those exclusions mean that prayer does absolutely zilch.
Bob Woodward of the Washington Post once wrote, you will never get an "engineers drawing" of history. That 100 percent is impossible which really a big thing to say from a reporter and author (read that from his book). Memory, perspective, and interest will always play a part in reducing or increasing those percentages.
Memory – what do you remember? what evidence; physical, oral, or whatever can say that such a place, location, people, idea, or point event existed.
Perspective – from what angle do you see those events, memories, or evidences. Bonifacio can be or was considered as a terrorist by the Spanish. He was a hero to the Filipinos. There is no malice involved, and neither side is really lying in having opposite views.
Self-Interest – do you really want to remember such an embarrassing or horrible memory? Or if you could, since it is in your power to tell the tale, can't be flattering to your side, your image. How about burning books opposite to your idea.
Can be a headache really playing with those three words and history. It can be used both ways so I guess it will all boil down to not living ones life based on people from thousands of years ago.